winchester model 12 simmons rib winchester model 12 simmons rib

Numbers match on barrel and receiver. Although acquired many years apart, the two duck guns are of nearly the same vintages, 1952 and 1953. Free shipping for many products! However, the gun for which Johnson is best remembered is his Model 12 pump-action shotgun, The Perfect Repeater.. The buttstock was reshaped on Model 12 shotguns again in the mid-1950s. Exquisite Winchester Model 12, 20 gauge with Modified bore. Charles Askins is the father of the late Colonel Charles Askins, Jr., of course. For more information: www.p65warnings.ca.gov. Notes - Delivery *Estimated delivery dates include seller's handling time, origin ZIP Code, destination ZIP Code and time of acceptance and will depend on shipping service selected and receipt of cleared payment. or Rudy Dozenrod out of Wyndemere, S.D. your community AND if they have it in stock, you can pick your gun up WARNING! The Model 12 duck gun came to market at the all-time low point of duck populations in the United States. In duck shooting the proportion of magazine guns in use is much higher, probably four men in five using the repeater. Askins added, Fact is, personally, I have always thought that I was surer on the second bird with a repeater than I was with a double gun. On gauges for duck hunting: No fault is to be found with the twelve [gauge] as a duck gun, whether in double barrel with 3 inch cases or in repeaters with 2 3/4 inch. Each fired target was turned over and a 30-inch cardboard disc placed to cover the maximum number for pellet holes. It still is. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. The straight grip stock, optional from 1935, was discontinued in the late 1950s. Can you help me out? Bids. View cart for details. This test, along with a check of adjustment remaining in the takedown joint and functioning of the slide lock dis-connector, are my standard mechanical checks for a Model 12. The barrels and receivers of Model 12 duck guns are made from Winchester Proof Steel. This steel was first used in the Model 21 double introduced in 1931. Ab steadies the boat. Model 42s with later ribs than the donut post, with no Simmons markings or with Simmons markings, and with proof marks in the proper places are thought to have had their ribs installed at Simmons and sent back to Winchester for marketing or marketed at Simmons. only one I have ever seen unless TS member owns one? No Reserve. It is first shooting light. But they must pass our way to clear! Dave Riffle in his book, The Greatest Hammerless Repeating Shotgun Ever Built: The Model 12 1912-1964, states The Winchester Model 12 was, and still remains, the only gun that was offered in over 100 different variations or configurations during its lifetime. It is fair to say that Winchester produced Model 12 shotguns for every conceivable shotgunning special interest group, including duck hunters. Has a Cutz on the end of the barrel. If you pull the trigger and the shell does not fire you must push the slide handle forward to unlock the action. I have often wondered how well my guns would pattern with modern ammunition. Blue Book on this fine collector 12 gauge is around $2,700! Nickel and ivory sight beads on the aftermarket Simmons rib, with choke marked full and 2 3/4 inch chamber. Market hunting was legislated out of existence in the late teens. Simmons vent rib and custom AA+ walnut furniture. I used to club trap targets with it. When I went to the university in a different town I worked for another gun shop that was an authorized Winchester Repair Center. His Super Fox 12 gauge magnum double averaged 83.7% (two-barrel average) of 1 3/8ounces of shot under the same conditions. Every cowboy needs a revolver. And make the 42 any grade you want and a self described winchester know it all couldn't tell the differance and may have bought one. It is general consensus that 10 patterns are required for an accurate appraisal of a given load and barrel combination. 12 Gauge, This is a very nice Winchester Model 12 Trap pump action shotgun in 12 gauge. Their attitude is summed up by Elmer Keith in Shotguns by Keith: the satisfaction of seeing big ducks crumple at long range and come down and bounce on the ground or splash high in the water is the cream of shotgun shooting., It is my view that the long-range duck-hunting cult was a legacy from the days of market hunting. The 1 5/8-ounce load of the mid-30s bought the 12 magnum a few more yards of range. Something went wrong. Yes the 2-pin milled rib was costly to manufacture. An 80% pattern they felt should make it a real 60-yard outfit with No. I always wondered what the royalty was to Simmons on the Winchester Special Ventilated Rib that they installed. Standard markings, with matching numbers on the receiver and barrel. Bluing is in overall very good condition. WE DO NOT SHIP INTERNATIONALLY $40 Shipping. Stadt's book is a very good book that alot of people don't seem to know about. Charles Askins was the leading expert on shotguns in the first half of the last century. It was John Olin who inspired Westerns revolutionary Super-Xshotshell in 1921. Condition: excellent bright bore, 98% blue overall thinn, Winchester Model 12. It would stop ducks consistently at 80 yards. Two years after Askins wrote the above, he received from Ithaca the first 3 1/2inch Magnum 10 double off the assembly line. I have a questionwhen a gun is described as having a "milled rib" I thought that referred to the fact that the barrel had posts that were milled as part of the barrel instead of being attachedI see guns described as having "round post milled ribs" I don't think that is correct? The help you need is to get a life. at the best online prices at eBay! Winchester Model 12 1940's gun. By 1955, the options were matted rib, ventilated rib, straight or pistol grip stock and buttstock and extension slide handle checkered. part of our network, we sell THEIR guns first whenever possible. own to figure out what you want. Winchester stated both 2 1/2 and 2 3/4 shells perform satisfactorily in this [duck] gun. The ejection port of the duck gun is about 1/8-inch longer than the standard port. $550 USD. The number of pellet holes was divided by the average number of pellets in the load to produce the pattern percentage. Featured Gun Classifieds Winchester Shotguns - Model 12, Winchester Model 12 - 20ga - 26 - Improved Cylinder- NIB - UNFIRED - SN: MT0162 - AS NEW with high figured wood - 2 3/4" Shells note: particles/dust can be seen in the photo, In very good condition. on your local stores shelf, most retailers drop ship it from a warehouse in Pandemonium! The gun weighed 8 1/2 pounds with its 32-inch Full choke barrel. Most annoying was the failure of the action-slide lock to function properly. M, ventilated rib, mid 1950's manufacture, completely original, only one ever produced by Winchester, ultimate rarity for the Model 12 co, 12ga, #1737096, standard gun that has been restocked and has a Simmons ventilated rib added, 12ga, 30 inch barrel, full choke, 2 3/4 inch chamber, 14 3/4 inch LOP with "Decelerator" pad, blu, Winchester Model 12 - 20ga - 26 - Improved Cylinder- NIB - UNFIRED - SN: MT0162 - AS NEW with high figured wood, Winchester Model 12 28 gauge Skeet solid rib. The 12 month average price is $622.51 new and $661.18 used. I have the wood all refinished. The Model 12 was the first magazine repeater chambered for 3-inch magnum shells. It is not as slow or pokey as one might expect. The staff shot skeet with the gun and concluded It is not as fast as the standard Model-12, but nearly so., In further shooting tests the staff found We could not discern any practical difference in recoil effect when shooting standard three inch heavy duck loads. Winchester supplied two boxes of 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8-ounces of #5 chilled shot pushed by four drams equivalent of powder. The locked breech bolts of both guns have little perceptible play when the rear of the bolt is pressed from the side. My favorite 2 pins were Trap Guns made between 1957-1959 including special order Pigeon grades; fit, finish and blueing was best in those later years. Winchester Model 12 with checkered forearm (slide handle) b'. All Rights Reserved, Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck Gun 30" Simmons Vent Rib 1953 Pre 64 Rare 12 Ga. Magnum 3" Edition Proof Marking. I read your posts; you do love the Model 12, been there done that. Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without A great looking gun, in excellent condition. organized, dont tell you a lot about what youre buying, and leave you on your A red rubber Winchesterre coil pad was added the first year of production. Johnson designed the Models 52 and 61 rimfire rifles and the Model 54 centerfire rifle. Winchester Model 12 in 16 ga with a 26" barrel with a full choke. Enthusiastic hunters bought the new repeater. If not it has been shot very little and stored under the right conditions. Ernie special order model 12's from Winchester to add his Dounut Vent Rib. My 1951 Winchester Ammunition Handbook gives a comparison of 17 to 11 feet at 60 yards. Must be shipped to an FFL, New price, Listed is a like new Winchester DU, Model-12, 12 Ga Pump Shotgun. service to the online gun buying experience that is unheard of. BARREL 30" CHOKE FULL 90% FACTORY BLUE ORIGINAL FACTORY HEAVY DUCK RECOIL PAD WOOD VERY GOOD. These are rare, a line can be seen along the dounut post on both sides. generous return policy, and handle everything you dont have to go back to When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. I pick them up through the interlacing covert, a bunch of suspicious mallards driving for safety. Tried to talk him out of doing it and sell him a build up gun but he wanted a vent rib on it as it was his dad's gun. These ribs have Simmons markings. However, killing ducks at long range remained the objective of many duck hunters. I fired 10 patterns for each of the five test loads in each of the two duck guns, for a total of 100 patterns. becouse plain barrels shoot higher than solid ribs do ,solid ribs shoot flatter. But it would be my guess that the wood has been refinished and the gun has been reblued. Winchester - Model 12 Factory Try-Gun, 12ga, 30" Barrel. When it was. It looks like it is in very good shape. However, Winchesters ribs were not marked with the Simmons name and Kansas City address as mine is. Winchester Model 12 Takedown Slide Action Shotgun with Simmons Ventilated RibProduced in 1961. Winchester Model 12 Skeet Gun 12 gauge with 25" Solid Rib Barrel - 12 GA: 0 5d 7h 6m 17240921. The $48 price tag was right. Winchester symbol # G1285S. Western brought out their Super-X 2-3/4 and 3-inch shotshells in 1921. By signing up you agree to Guns.com's - Top Rated Plus - opens in a new window or tab, - eBay Money Back Guarantee - opens in a new window or tab. And for this reason the spike in prices for the forty two will go back down becouse there is a alternative that is for sure and safe and they know all the things that people look for to see if it came from the winchester factory. WINCHESTER MODEL 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN 30" SIMMONS VENT RIB 1953 PRE-64 RARE 12 GA. MAGNUM 3" EDITION PROOF MARKING - 12 GAUGE MAGNUM - 5 - 30 " Probably a lot farther than we can hit em. President Roosevelt signed the law limiting magazine repeaters to three shells for migratory game bird hunting in 1935. It was manufactured in 1962 and is a skeet grade. Westerns 3-inch 12-gauge magnum with 1 3/8-ounces of shot was introduced the same year. The less pronounced pistol grip-style buttstock of the original Model 12 was discontinued in late 1934 and is not found on duck guns. Manufactured in 1959. Stock is very fine, with light scratching, pressure dents and an attractive grain pattern. Askins Ithaca 10-gauge double with 2 7/8-inch chambers averaged 86.9% with 1 5/8-ounces of shot. Great communications. However, the Model 12 duck gun should still be an excellent long-range waterfowl shotgun with the right ammunition. Thanks for the reference. I don't believe their ever was a royalty, actually Simmons kept selling his special vent rib model 12's after the 1955 introduction of the Winchester Special Vent Rib @ New Haven. Fanciers of long-range shotguns now had a 12-gauge repeater shooting a 10-gauge shot load. George Watrous, a longtime Winchester employee with many talents, was commissioned to investigate the good and bad points of Winchesters pre-war line and make suggestions for postwar improvement. Refresh your browser window to try again. . Its been debated over the years if the solid rib model 12 barrel were silver brazed or fused with heat? In an ad in the October 1952 American Rifleman, Winchester proclaimed. Checkered semi-fancy walnut pistol grip stock with extended forearm and a solid Winchester recoil pad. It is in excellent condition with only light handing marks, Used Browning BT99 Plus 12 gauge 28" bbl fixed choke mod good condition no box no manuals Buyer pays shipping Millers Gun Center Located in New Castle, Delaware "Home of TAX, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 16GA PUMP ACTION SHOTGUN, 26" BBL, 2 3/4, POLY CHOKE, RIBLESS, EJECTORS, SINGLE TRIGGER, MEDIUM DARK FIGURED WALNUT, PISTOL GRIP, LOP 14 3/8, 1 1/2, 2 5/16, 7LBS 3OZ, 985 BLUE, Winchester. Shooting the Model 12 Duck Gun I own two Model 12 duck guns. The Olins bought Winchester for $8.1 million through a combination of $3.3 million cash and the balance in an issue of preferred stock. At a reasenable Price, you can have that gun you allways wanted without all this drama. Also, the rib and its receiver extension cover the Winchester proof marks, a sure sign that it is not factory installed. We join Buckingham in his ducking skiff as he is poled through the bayou by Ab, his black guide. Save my name and email to use for future comments. Charles Askins commented on the new Model 12 duck gun in the March 1936 issue of Outdoor Life: This should be the best long-range repeating shotgun now made or that has been made. No faint praise, but hardly a surprise. Winchester Model 12 12 ga 30 in Barrel 2 3/4" Full vent rib Barrel NICE! Thomas C. Johnson came to Winchester in 1885 and remained a dedicated employee until his death in 1934. Winchester Model 1300 Speed Pump - 12 GA $395.00: 0 $395.00 1d 15h 33m 17222600. Winchester recognized the scarcity of ducks in their promotional advertisement of the new duck gun To Meet the New Wildfowling Conditions. I suspect most Model 12 duck guns bought before World War II were put to work on other game. . Copyright 1995-2023 eBay Inc. All Rights Reserved. Franklin and his two sons John M. Olin and Spencer T. Olin were the managers of Olin Industries and Western Cartridge Company in 1931. This gun has been single family owned since bought used in 1967. There are Simmons marketed guns with proper Winchester proof marks. He did note, however, that the rib first appeared at about serial number 240,000. This shotg, FOR SALE IS A VERY NICE VINTAGE WINCHESTER MODEL 12, 12GA GA SHOTGUN. No Reserve . Today I have a nice collection of them, mostly target grade guns. First of all was the end of management by people who were not familiar or sympathetic with the gun and ammunition business. The Olins were avid duck hunters. $899.97. But the charm of idle jump-shooting is far too potent.. Exc Orig Condition, Winchester Model 12 28-gauge, factory original, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 LIMITED EDITION 20GA. Askins wrote in his 1929 book Modern Shotguns and Loads: Perhaps half the game that is killed in America today is shot with repeating shotguns, pump or automatic. Very fine as professionally custom finished, showing 95% of the refurbished blue, with scattered rust spotting and handling marks. Curious, I fired five additional patterns at 60 yards with Model 12 number 1418XXX and the Winchester load of 1 5/8-ounces of #4 shot. He spent many years as firearms editor for Outdoor Life and later Field and Stream, as well as shotgun editor for the American Rifleman. He was the chief designer of the Model 21 double, John Olins favorite. Everything functions as it should. The duck gun made in 1952 has a Simmons ventilated rib. He worked with another Winchester researcher. , Winchester - Model 12, Deluxe, Pump Action, RARE 28ga. The deeply blued barrel and receiver frame are very good. Winchester ~ Model 12 Trap ~ Pump Action Shotgun ~ 12 Gauge. 2023 Rock Island Auction Company. Important to note that this gun was made in 1956, the first year for the round post factory installed Special Ve, FOR YOUR VIEWING IS A VERY NICE WINCHESTER MODEL 12 in 20 GA. WITH A VENT RIBBED 26" BARREL AND IC CHOKED. the barrel and chamber are bright and clean. Built from 1912 to 1963. Teal, mallard, widgeon and sprig [pintail] hover singly and in bunches overhead. Manufactured in 1959. 1938 lists the stock for a 12 gauge skeet grade as 14" with a Buttplate. Wood is in very good condition showing very little handling or wear marks. Winchester suggests their 3-inch 12-gauge shotshells with 1 3/8-ounces or 1 5/8-ounces of #4 shot for wildfowl hunting in their 1951 Ammunition Handbook: These shells were developed especially for extremes in long range shooting with 12-gauge Winchester Model 12 and Model 21 Heavy Duck Guns.. Firearms dont get much more iconic than John Moses Brownings legendary Auto-5 semi-auto shotgun, affectionately called the Humpback for its distinctive drop at the rear of the receiver. We'rebringing a level of THE SHOTGUN HAS A 30' PLAIN BARREL AND IS FULL CHOKE. Madis states Ventilated ribs were rarely offered on [duck] guns. However, The fact is a few duck guns were provided with these ribs. Dave Riffles book and the various catalogs I have indicate that the Winchester new ventilated rib was an option from about 1954 to 1959. Thought behind it was that a taller rib on the bbl and a higher comb on the stock would help prevent "head lifting". But I manage to concentrate, find the combination, and center a pair of easy sprigs. of a company that is committed to your satisfaction. Pictures are of the item listed. The used value of a WINCHESTER MODEL 12 shotgun has fallen ($310.78) dollars over the past 12 months to a price of $447.25 . Auction Date: December 7, 2019 Estimated Price: $ 8,500 - $ 13,000 Price Realized: Details Exceptional and Documented Smoothbore Winchester Model 61 Slide Action "Rifle" with Simmons Vent Rib and Box Manufacturer: Winchester Model: 61 Type: Shotgun Gauge: 22 LR Shot Barrel: 24 inch vent rib Finish: blue Grip: Stock: walnut Item Views: 1599 Twelve magnum guns grew lighter over the years and consequently kick harder. My name is Chuck 620 515 0556. Serial numbers match on barrel and receiver. No other pump shotgun feels like the duck gun. The latest 2-pin rib gun researched has a serial number of 19114xx with a date of August 26th, 1960. Winchester designed the Model 42 to use the new shell and the combo went to market in 1932. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Winchester installed Simmons ribs and Simmons-designed ventilated ribs for several years. The famous Winchester Model 1912 pump shotgun was designed by Winchester's Thomas C. Johnson. Sto, Used Winchester 12 20 Gauge, Pump-Action Shotgun, 25" Barrel Wood Stock, No Box. The duck gun sent to the American Rifleman staff in 1935 would not unlock during recoil. The vent rib is stamped "SIMMONS GUN SPECIALTIES INC. KANSAS CITY, MO.". And our The committee appointed to study the requirements for continuing business reported a successful reorganization would require the raising of a substantial amount of new capital. That capital was supplied by the Olin family of Olin Industries, owners of Western Cartridge Company. community. Ernie Simmons had a close relationship with Winchester & John Olin; if you find any NSSA ,ATA, Field & Stream and Sports Afield magazines pre-war and post war you'll find he sold plenty of Winchesters out of his gun shop and attended many shoots selling target guns. And, as WRACO states, Simmons installed Model 12 ribbed guns were sold by Simmons, not Winchester. K-Mart Classics: Remingtons Nylon Rimfires Engineered To Last. is 14" with pad. I am still going with "Winchester sent Model 12s to Simmons for ribs, but Simmons sold them." "SN:561491. THE VENTILATED RIB IS BY SIMMONS GIN, 16ga, Full Choke, 26" barrel with a bright and shiny bore. Winchester made changes to the stock of the Model 12 duck gun after its introduction. Alex, we don't have enough info to give you an informed opinion. Charles Askins confirmed the tighter patterns and greater effective range in the field. Made in 1928, 12 Gauge, 28"" barrel. Field grade pump gun with Mod choke barrel. Length of pull was reduced in January 1936 to reflect the extra clothing worn by duck hunters. Small depression in the magazine tube, as shown in pictures. Come join the discussion about targets, clays, hunting, gunsmithing, gear reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! The Model 21 double seemed the reasonable choice for Winchesters duck gun. An incredible collector grade limited production 1953 Model 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN SIMMONS VENT RIB that is offered below Blue Book value. Delivery times may vary, especially during peak periods. 80 of 1916 indicates seven empty 12-gauge paper shell lengths (2-1/2 to 3-1/4 inches). I put one of those BIG soft foam risers on the comb and shot it that way for years. This gun is in excellent condition and has very desireable solid rib barrel with full choke. Buckingham had a solid 60-yard duck gun and was on his way to becoming a legend. The fact that the Winchester proof marks are now 'off set', caused me to believe the gun may have been returned to the factory for the rib installation. Model 42s with donut post ribs, no Simmons markings, proof marks in the right places, in the proper serial number range, are considered to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. I believe that Stadt's book is one of the few that actually states that Winchester did produce M42s with Winchester vent ribs. That is why I have never used one of my duck guns for duck hunting. Winchester proof steel is chrome-molybdenum steel. I decided to test the patterning of the five loads detailed in the accompanying table. The solid rib gun shows carrying wear while the ventilated rib gun was refinished when the rib was installed. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. According to the Serial# 1439865, and Winchester manufacturing records, this gun w. 12ga, #366988, 30 inch barrel, 2 1/2 inch chamber, full choke, solid rib, blue finish, straight grip checkered walnut stock, checkered walnut forearm, 13 3/4 LOP with "newer" Winchester pad, 12ga, #1417110, 30 inch barrel, 3 inch chamber, full choke, blue finish, walnut stock and forearm, solid rib, original red rubber pad, 1954. Thereafter, a staggering number of variations were produced during the 1912-1980 period. Generally, a Simmons rib gun will bring a higher price than a plain barrel gun, and a lower price than a solid rib or Winchester vent rib gun, all other factors being equal. Duck guns always sold for a slight premium over the standard model. - Straight Sighting Plane - Floating Vent rib action - Extra Strong Silver soldered posts Gun Type Over/Under w/RBSingle Barrel w/RB